if Antero already hold an old old lease (1961) and now they need my signature for “pooling rights”? does anyone know what that means? Do I really have any rights… they offered “1 dollar” … can we renegotiate an old lease they supposedly already acquired… I am new to this and have no idea what I’m doing…
Dawn, If you can read your 1961 lease, see if it mentions pooling or unit size. I don’t think they did that in the 1960s but I have a 1989 that does. If it is not mentioned they do need you to sign an amendment or something to allow it.
As has been said, if you are receiving royalties this lease would be still valid but if you haven’t received royalties for a few years there may be wording in your lease to say how long the lease is in effect and conditions to keep it. You are getting good advice here. Read your lease and try to see what it tells you.
And you should certainly get more than $1. You can ask for an overriding royalty of 1 or 2%.
Dawn, What were the terms of the lease, most are for 5-10 years. It seems to me that you should be able to negotiate that lease with anyone, don’t let them dazzle you.
I’ve gotten a royalty check but not from Antero… would another company be sending checks? I think I get a check a year for like $20… but I think it was from CNX… my leases are so old I get .48 cents bills for taxes on about 10 different properties but never get royalty checks… this is so confusing … I can’t really read the copy of the lease they sent me. The guy that sent the paperwork for me to sign the pooling agreement is Jeremy McGowan “curative-Landman” Texhoma Land Consultants… a representative of Antero Resources. So does this mean he actually works for Antero or for himself??
Dawn, Antero Resources was formed in 2002, so Antero must have acquired the lease from another Company, Do you have the original lease? and what were the terms and conditions pertaining to length of time? As mentioned before I doubt if there was a pooling clause, are you getting royalty? Also it must be a vertical well, and if Antero is drilling a horizontal I would think that everything changes. I bet a dollar to a doughnut that what they want you to sign is a modification to the original adding the pooling clause. This has been discussed on this forum before and you can either sign or see and Attorney, my advise is to see an Attorney.
I was getting a royalty check but I just got the lease signed Friday. Some how only part of my family signed the lease back in 2001 an they missed others. However I did get royalty checks for years. An now with new lease they have to go back an fix the %.
Dawn, I had a similar situation where I owned 11.3 ac in a 273 ac plat, I was getting royalty $3.75 a month from Dominion then CNX. The original lease was dated 09-24-1909. This is how the modification from Antero read>In Oct of 2008, Antero completed the acquisition of this 273 acres, and plan to drill one or two horizontal wells on the above lease. A pooling provision is required in the above referenced Oil & Gas Lease so Antero must request a modification of the original lease. There offer was $1.00. Now I sat and thought about this for day’s, thinking attorney or sign for $1.00, my final decision was based on the fact that the product has sat in the ground for 105 years and all I was getting was $3.75 a month, Since Antero was going to drill Horizontal, I should receive much more in Royalty than the $3.75. The bottom line in my case is if I don’t see it my kid’s will, why should I quibble over something that has been doing no one any good for 105 years. SO I SIGNED.
Mike, I hope you had an excellent attorney. I don’t know the law and statute of limitations on back royalty in WV. but other places it is about 4 years.
I only mention this because you say now they have to go back and fix the %. Ask yourself this question, why precisely would they have to go back and fix the percent, after you have executed a lease? There is the matter of waiver, you accepted checks for years, did you constantly complain?
I would have wanted the back royalty fixed at lease signing because you can’t trust an oil company to do any particular thing in the future
Mr. Stuart, your signing that pooling agreement just made that lease worth a whole lot more whether they ever drill it or not.
Now they can make a pile of money selling that lease to someone else who won’t drill it either.
I’m not like these oil and gas people but if I were, I would be researching you to see if you would give away the farm to me also. Just because something has not been paying you does not mean it has no value. I think it’s possible you could have gotten a royalty update, at least on the new horizontal wells. That old lease was probably at 1/8 and you could have possibly gotten 14% or 15% on the supposed new wells, something small but possibly still significant to you.
It’s yours, you can do whatever you want with it,
I just can’t pass on the logic you used, and whether you knew how valuable what you gave away was, or that you knew they could turn around and assign to someone else who also won’t drill, making a healthy profit, improving your situation not at all.
It’s been quiet, but I do have some news: Talking to an Antero Landman that is now working out of West Union in Doddridge County, saying that the following wells could be completed this year,>
Wilhelm #1-2, Maple #1, Amanda #1,Holding #1-2, and Mishka #1, although there has been some delays on Mishka, (title). There could be more but it was his second week in that area and he did not know of more. If any of these wells affect you, I would not get all excited because as you know in this business “things change”.
r w Kennedy I do have a good lawyer. My lawyer is holding the lease until back pay is paid up. It’s not my fault that the oil/gas company went ahead an started drilling an producing without all the owners signing a lease. So it’s only right to pay us what our lease states. An to the comment about Greed. The oil/gas company’s are greedy!! An it’s to the individual to get the best lease they can. Just think of bigger picture. Antero makes $17,000,000.00+ A well a month. So wanting your fair share is not greed. In my opinion. Also look at the oil/gas company’s initial lease offer!!! An then think of ALL the people that doesn’t no any better an signs the 1st offer. Food for thought. 
Mr. Kennedy, I still own my share and the lease is still good, I did not give up anything, only the possibility that they will drill on a track of land with my name on it, and if they don’t I’AM NOT OUT ANYTHING, and you are right the lease is worth a whole lot more now and if they do drill I might get something, something a lot more than I have now. The product is still there. Greed is a nasty word.
Right, the lease is worth alot more without having to drill it, they can make money assigning it to someone else, who also will not drill it. If you are not out anything, why did they offer you $1 so you couldn’t possibly cancel it? If it was of no value, why couldn’t it be revocable
It’s funny that you talk of greed. I have said that I would lease my land for a fair royalty with no bonus whatsoever, because I don’t want a bribe, just pay me a fair amount for the production.
I volunteered to take the risk along with the operator, that the well will be a bust and I would receive nothing. Is that greedy?
Also, lets rewind to the beginning, the oil is mine but I did not, have not and will not go around asking someone to drill and produce it. All of the operators have come to me saying they would force me if I do not agree. Does that sound like my greed?
I opposed the drilling of some of my acres. Does this sound greedy?
Someone, who will trade something of value for the mere mention of possible gain in the future sounds greedy to me, willing to do anything to make more money. But have it any way you like. Rational self interest does not necessarily mean greed. I drive a 1997 Toyota because it’s good enough for me. I watch a 10 year old 27 tv in my living room, not even a flat screen. I have had several people from the forums offer to pay me for my help, I declined but told them if we ever meet they owe me a cup of coffee. I am the epitomy of greed. A veritable tower of greed. I want mineral owners to make and keep more of their money, spend hours pointing out how that may be accomplished, I don’t see where I benefit monetarily from that but if I’m greedy, there must be some way.
I leased to KOG in 2009 and they didn’t pay me the bonus but recorded the lease. At the end of 2010 they started drilling the well and I gave them a call to mention that the draft had been returned unpaid twice. All I expected was that they would pay it. They surprised me when they said they didn’t have to pay it, the lease was valid anyway. I said I would see them in court because the draft returned unpaid twice and they recorded my lease twice. Then they offered 30 times the amount of the original lease bonus and 10% increase in royalty. I turned it down. You see, the money was not what is important to me, I want things done the correct way. Their apology and payment was what I was seeking but they said they didn’t need to pay me and things went very far south for them after that.
I don’t want to do business with someone who breaks agreements, especially if it’s about money. If I were greedy, I probably would have accepted their best lease offer. They also told me to name a price, I declined to do so. For a greedy person, that must be a palm forehead and ask what was I thinking moment. I need to work on this greedy thing, I just don’t seem to be very good at it, thanks for pointing that out. Have a great evening.
Sorry I offended you, it was not meant to be. Let’s bury this and get on to why this forum is so informative to everyone, lets help each other. Good Night and God Bless.
Hope it works out for you! I know the lease is very important to Antero. An back pay is nothing compared to the lease. So I’m sure they will pay quick. Lol
I was told the lease that was negotiated in1961 is still valid at 12% and I cannot renegotiate it because it is a legally binding lease. The $1 for me to sign the pooling clause is a legal thing, that a contract cannot be valid unless a monetary transaction has occurred. Hince the $1… to make it legally binding. I guess my question is has anyone ever been able to successfully renegotiate a royalty amount like that since I know 12% is really low? or is it not worth it and I should just sign for the pooling so they can do a horizontal drill? I’m good with opinions here and appreciate the different views on here.
Dawn, I think you should get more than $1. Nowadays leases sometimes say $10 but the actual payment is a lot more. Usually the phrase is $1 and other good and valuable services. Tell them you’ll take the 1 but also more .
How much acreage?
Mike, I hear you, loud and clear. Believe it or not, many lawyers in this day and age still TRUST oil companies to abide by the language of a lease, such as making the payment of back royalty and would have handed over the lease. It’s far better to hold the lease and make the oil company comply first. I am suing a small oil company over less than $10,000 [I’m sure they never thought I would] and it has cost far more than $10,000. I would do it again today because it’s not about the money, it’s about keeping the agreement, but many people would not agree and oil companies depend on that.
In my case, it’s the oil company that is complaining about the expense of the litigation and that brings a smile to my face.
There are some apparent rules in an oil and gas deal, I did not make them, I am just working within them.
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Always make a killing, if you aren’t going to make a killing, something is wrong with the deal.
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Be informed, and always be on the lookout for people who are uninformed to make deals with. See #1.
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Don’t do anything for free, if the recipient is going to make money off it, they can cut you in, or do without.
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Never trust anyone in an oil and gas deal, not brother, sister, aunt, uncle, and certainly not the person or entity that offered the deal to begin with. Watch your own lawyer and ask questions.
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Get what you really want and get it in writing, explicitly. Believe no verbal promises, it’s best to correspond by mail at all times. Save all correspondence, no matter how trivial it may seem, including the envelopes with postmarks. See #4.
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Never be afraid to walk away,unless you are someplace like Texas or Wyoming where they can drain you at will and never pay [under certain circumstances]. In most cases, the oil/gas has been there for a long time and is not going anywhere. Someone will be back, wanting the legal right to your minerals. Signing a 1/8 lease where the operator can take back 50% or more in marketing and after you pay taxes you have a net 2% to 4% royalty defeats the whole purpose of having your minerals produced in the first place, unless you just like the look of wellheads.
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Always receive payment, cash, cashiers check, at the very least company check, [not draft, bill of exchange, order for payment] before tendering an executed lease or agreement because it may cost you $100,000 out of pocket to force the other party to pay. See #4.
There are others but these are the biggies. Sad it has to be this way.
Remember that these companies come along and make an offer, most people do not call them up and beg them to consider producing their minerals. Most of these companies will do any devious underhanded thing they can think of or the the people they hire can think of to gain acess to your minerals because they are certain that by letting you keep a little more of your own money they can “fix” anything, that they can buy you off with your own money, essentially. The companies don’t actually lose money, they make less profit, so they do whatever they think necessary, certain that they can get away with it.
Since these companies are so desperate to produce your minerals and will go to such great lengths and are also claiming that they are taking all the risks, they should offer you a lease based on the value of production which bears no marketing costs, no costs at all other than taxes. This way anyone could calculate their royalty and make certain the are not being cheated. This way you don’t wind up with 2% when your lease says 17%, which lease does not even mention the marketing costs because it’s assumed by the courts that the lessee can deduct them unless absolutely forbidden in the lease.
I know people who have leased for 20% and they would have been better off leasing for 1/8 [12.5%] with no deductions other than taxes.
One might wonder how you could gain so little from owning mineral rights? The secret is after you lease them [a conveyance] you don’t really own them anymore. You may own them once again in the future but as soon as you tender the executed lease, you 100% don’t own them anymore. Ever hear that posession is 9/10ths of the law? It’s even greater than 9/10 ths in an oil and gas lease. No matter how heinous an act the lessee commits, you won’t get your minerals back. You now have a royalty interest in the production of the minerals. Said royalty interest can be subject to all sorts of charges if it is not specified in the lease itself that it is not, even then the operator may purposely not pay you correctly because all you can do is sue and spend tens of thousands of dollars out of pocket.
It’s 100 acres